Going forward in 2017 at OSF - 1

[OldTimer]

(01-29-2017 03:46 AM)MuskieBait Wrote:  

(01-28-2017 08:44 AM)OldTimer Wrote:  Citing the accomplishments of 2 members from a sea of 2000+ members should be pondered a while regarding what evidence it provides regarding the popularity of the contest.

Only 4 members participated............. ZippyFX, FossilFish, MA and I.

We need to do something different - else we will have the same dismal participation going forward.

Zippy’s suggestion of several categories provides for all levels of “willingness” to participate – without prejudice.

As you point out - One must be willing to try new things, and changes.

As always………………. opinions vary…………..

Cheers,

OldTimer

OT...you mentioned that when I cited 2 members that were encouraged to experiment out of the 2000+ members on OSF as bad evidence...

Well, let me ask you...how many members out of that 2000+ regularly even contribute a fishing report regularly...a discussion on technique regularly...or simply a "nice catch" regularly on the latest fishing reports? What's the percentage of that? I think you need to compare contest participating members as a fraction of ACTIVE members...not those 16'ers that came and went and never seen again. That's not a fair comparison at all.

Let's count the number of members who posted one or more fishing report in 2016. The new members posting their first report is not included...you and I know very well that the first report is just a means to gain entry into the report section. The vast majority of members who had posted their first report never posted again. So they are excluded here.

Here goes...active contributor to fishing reports since Jan 2016:

Oldtimer, tweedwolfscream, Muskiebait, PUMPKNOWS, Deadfisher, Toasty, zippyFX, Eli, ST_ShoreFisher, wknd outdoorsman

And I'll include FossilFish because he was definitely in the contest and fishing.

So that's 11 members! All YEAR! Heck? You think there's a low participation issue with the contest? How about general low engagement issue with the forum? Maybe we should change that first before dealing with the contest. Those who are not willing to even hang around the forum certainly won't be here to enter a silly contest just for bragging rights. They may not even want to be engaged in the first place, besides asking for new fishing locations or looking up the latest fishing report to find the latest hot action.

So if you REALLY want to crunch the numbers to give you a representative picture, you have 4 members in the contest out of 11 active members. Heck...that's 36.36%! And out of that, 2 members (18.18%) were influenced by the contest to diversify their fishing...realizing the goal that MA and I hoped to accomplished with the contest. Man, that's AWESOME! If MA and I were to actually join in (which I voluntarily opted out to make the playing field fair and achieveable)...that's even greater participation.

But hey, where's our fearless leader MA throughout this year? Without leadership and a vision, the group simply falls apart...

Consider this...in 2012 and 2013, when the contest was first introduced, there were 9 participants. But out of those 9, some member, like Guiga10, Onwind and McFly, had not posted consistently, or at all, for the past couple of years. Where did they go? Why are they not engaged in the forum like they were in the past?

I've seen really great forums fall apart...when some core members got busy, got married, had kids, bought a house, grew up, moved away, changed fishing interest...and the forum just fell apart. It happens...more often than you think...especially for niche or grass root group like here.

So the low participation in the contest is simply a reflection of low forum engagement in general. Unless you use prizes to draw people to it.

Now...let's say you were right...and your argument is valid that perhaps there are more members interested (which I've shown with DATA to be contrary to the argument)...

You can't please everyone...and you can't make it all an even playing field.

Let's consider the proposed categories, shall we? I am very openminded, after all.

Standard - Compare Thames River with over 40 standard species vs. Haliburton Lake with only 8 standard species. How is it possible for us to make it a level playing field for a member who lives in Haliburton, but not wiling to drive a hour or two to reach more species rich waters?

Micro - Again, northern waters is relative poor in diversity compared to the north....even though most people think micros give an unfair advantage.

Fly - Let's just consider rivers alone. North shore Huron trib vs. Grand River. No comparison. I can outfish you on the fly with "trash fish" on the Grand before you even catch 5 species on the fly on a north shore Huron trib...

Icefishing - Should we discuss how North Bay season starts in mid-December and ends in mid-April vs southern Ontario where we are barely even able to get on the ice for the past couple of winters? Where's the fairness and level playing field? Should we discuss how plentiful fish are in the northern lakes, while members can barely catch a 1h north of GTA walleye through the ice?

Anything else?

Fact is...you can't level the playing field...unless you fish on the same lake or river as a venue. When you are doing an online contest, there will always be advantages and disadvantages. Some will be advantageous for you, and some will be against you.

And that's why we decided to keep prizes out of this contest. That's why it's just for fun. And participation is just to challenge members to beat their personal best or chase the board leader. If you include prizes, and the playing field is not level, then you have constant whining that it isn't fair. Then you end up with a bass contest in the very end.

If distance is too far and you don't want to drive to catch a number of species for a silly online contest, you simply won't do it.

I'll tell you what's the cause of the low participation...the lack of material prizes. It's been brought up before by other members...and even MA. People don't want to waste time and money on a silly contest just for bragging rights.

I'll bet you...if there is a nice fishing combo, a sonar or a boat as a prize, there will be people participating and there will be more people fishing for silly little micros just to win those prizes! Why do you think people enter salmon derby and bass tournaments? Because there's a material or monetary reward. Heck, they would even PAY to enter those contest even if they chances of winning is against them. People do cost benefit analysis in their heads all the time...and the cost to gain bragging rights is just not equal to the benefit. But hey, if the cost was gas but the benefit was potentially a boat...it's a whole different ball game.

People will make excuses...

Heck, people drive further than a couple of hours just to try to catch a walleye for a meal on a weekend trip...or a big bass to brag about at the water cooler on Monday. People drive all the way to Nipissing just to try to catch their first walleye. People spent 2 years or more on Simcoe just trying to catch a Lake Whitefish through the ice. All that money spend with little reward...yet they persist. If people value something, and there's a will, there's a way. It's all about MOTIVATION.

Wow.

........ so really...what's your point?.... we changing things then?

Cheers,

OldTimer